AmyV
Senior Member
Let's Go Bucs!
Posts: 199
|
Post by AmyV on Jul 29, 2009 12:52:53 GMT -4
Pirates have traded Jack Wilson and Ian Snell to the Seattle Mariners for 5 players: first baseman Jeff Clement, shortstop Ronny Cedeno and right-handed pitchers Aaron Pribanic, Brett Lorin and Nathan Adcock. Now, I honestly couldn't care less about Snell. I really didn't like him. I DO care though about Jack. Not only is he an amazing shortstop, but he was my favorite Pirate! I am surely going to miss him in black and gold. He will always be my favorite baseball player (in general) I am not giving up on being a fan or the players, but I have given up on the Front Office. I officially hate Neal Huntington!
|
|
|
Post by joshsec14 on Jul 29, 2009 13:57:21 GMT -4
Ronny Cedeno is not a bad ball player. He will fill a void left by Jack's departure. Cedeno is no Jack Wilson though.
|
|
AmyV
Senior Member
Let's Go Bucs!
Posts: 199
|
Post by AmyV on Jul 29, 2009 13:58:28 GMT -4
Ronny Cedeno is not a bad ball player. He will fill a void left by Jack's departure. Cedeno is no Jack Wilson though. I'll take your word for it that he is a good player. I'm sure he is but you are right, he is no Jack Wilson. No one will ever be a Jack except Jack. I realize that we are trying to rebuild the team, but it seems like they are also destroying the team. First, you trade Bay last year, one of the best players. Then McLouth says good-bye and then Morgan. Just thinking about those three guys (along with the others we traded) look how much talent we lost. I know that with the new guys we got, we will get their talent too (obviously) but it is extremely hard to replace the guys we had. This is really the main reason why I hate Neal. It isn't just because I liked these players but because of what they brought to the field. Even though I am not excited about this, I do wish Jack the best. Being with the Mariners, he now has a better chance of winning (not going to lie...but he does) and he deserves that for how great of a player he is and how much he works his butt off. Pirates fans are going to miss him!
|
|
|
Post by joshsec14 on Jul 29, 2009 15:44:57 GMT -4
Trading Nyjer Morgan was just assanine. The McClouth deal I understood but Morgan going was just stupid. I was watching Pirates Pregame and Stan Savran said that there is a chance that Freddy Sanchez could be traded to the Giants by the time the game ends or before the pirates leave san francisco.
|
|
AmyV
Senior Member
Let's Go Bucs!
Posts: 199
|
Post by AmyV on Jul 29, 2009 15:57:01 GMT -4
The trade talks on Freddy are still open, but right now they are kind of at a halt considering his mysterious knee injury. I do not want Freddy to get traded, but honestly I really think he is going to. With Neal on a trading frenzy (if you would like to look at it that way) anyone could be traded. At first I know I said in this post (if you read it before I modified it) that I would want Freddy to get traded not because I do not like him (he is my other favorite player actually) but because I didn't know how he would be without his best friend. This morning whenever Jack told him he was traded, Freddy was so emotional and so upset that he couldn't even speak and refused to talk to the media. In the interviews just put up on the internet ( www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/pirates/buccoblog/ ) you can tell that they are both upset to not being able to play with each other anymore. My original thought was that I would rather see Freddy play on a different team than see him unhappy with the Pirates because Jack is no longer there to turn double plays with him or joke around with him about stuff. Now thinking about it more after hearing the interviews and just in my mind, I would like to keep him so then we still have that leadership on the team, the talent and so then the team is not ripped apart even more than what it is now with popular guys being traded. Yet, like I said, no one is really safe on this team at this point in time.
|
|
|
Post by section8guy on Jul 29, 2009 16:57:41 GMT -4
You do realize that sports is not a popularity contest right? It's about putting a winning product on the field, which has not happened in 17 years. Jack did his time here, became one of the most popular players in recent history, and was a great person in the community. However, he's being paid $8.5 million to do one thing...play defense. Where has his bat been since his big year in 2004? Ian Snell...yikes...good riddance.
McClouth, Wilson, Sanchez, Laroche, and yes, even the beloved Nyjer Morgan...those are just bit players on good teams, not superstars and Morgan is in an even worse situation than here right now down in Washington. Being a star takes on an entirely different meaning in a city dying for a winner, we'll hold on to anyone we can get, even if they only hit .250 with 20 homers or win 12 games with an ERA over 4.00. All you're doing in that case is putting lipstick on a pig...they're good for Pittsburgh, but that doesn't mean they're superstars in other situations or cities.
This is absolutely the wrong front office to give up on. The Bonifay/Littlefield disasters are why we are watching all of these trades happen. This was a bare bones organization when Huntington and Coonelly took over and they're trying to build it with young talent through the draft and trades(some more popular than others), not stop-gap, over the hill, overpriced free agents. That's what has gone on for way to long now and look where it's gotten us...we're sulking over the loss of players that really were only All-Stars because they HAD to take one Pirate representative.
This front office is concerned about building a winner for the long term, not just trying to get to .500. The goal of professional baseball is to win championships, not just get to 82-80. So if that means sacrificing the big names now for a consistent winner in a year or two, I'll take that trade off in a heart beat.
|
|
|
Post by pearsennui on Jul 29, 2009 17:36:20 GMT -4
I am encapsulated by surprise and awe... I will believe it when i see it....... I think being 27 and 17 years of losing seasons.... I am bitter at the organization...
|
|
AmyV
Senior Member
Let's Go Bucs!
Posts: 199
|
Post by AmyV on Jul 29, 2009 17:50:42 GMT -4
pearseunni - I am only 15, so think about it. I haven't even been alive for a winning season! I would like to see one, but as of right now, I am not convinced I will with the trades we have made.
section8guy, I am aware that sports is not a popularity contest. I may be young, but I am not stupid. I only said that many people will be upset and that this is a stupid trade because they were loved in Pittsburgh.
I am aware that we are trying to get the team to a winning season and that is why the trades are happening. I am aware that Neal wants to "rebuild" the team to break the streak, (hey I would like to see a winning season..don't get me wrong).
I will also agree with you that whenever Littlefield was here, it was a mess. I didn't like Littlefield at all and I am happy that we fired him. With Neal, I am not only upset with the trades he is making (obviously) but because he is cheap and with the way he announces the trades. If you would listen to or read about the things he says on the trades, it gets me angry because it sounds like he really had no faith in Jack or Nyjer or the others in helping us get out of this slump. (Which, yes I am aware they were on the team during this streak but it is not just them, it is the other players also) He makes it sound like the guys we are getting in the deals are the best things ever (which they may be..I am not saying they are bad players) and that sure he liked watching the others play great defense, but he really had no faith in what they were going to do.
Popularity is one of the smaller reasons why fans are upset that many players have been traded. But, if you ask other fans (the ones that I have talked to at least) and me, we are more upset with how Neal is talking about the trades in interviews and just the fact that, sure he may be "rebuilding" but he may be taking the wrong path in doing so.
|
|
AmyV
Senior Member
Let's Go Bucs!
Posts: 199
|
Post by AmyV on Jul 29, 2009 19:00:21 GMT -4
So I know I should probably just stop talking about the subject, but according to the Post-Gazette, the Pirates have traded Freddy Sanchez to the Giants for Class AA pitcher Tim Alderson.
This is really no surprise. We all knew this was coming soon. I am reading comments on the Post-Gazette and everyone on there says Alderson is a great pitcher. We will see how he does.
Best of luck to Freddy in San Francisco!
|
|
|
Post by pearsennui on Jul 29, 2009 20:03:22 GMT -4
If. If. If...
play the prospect game.
|
|
|
Post by BrianV on Jul 29, 2009 23:27:12 GMT -4
I don't have a problem with Huntington. I think he's doing the best with what was given to him. There's still plenty of fog about the future, but the difference is that now we have some legitimate reason to hope for a winning season. I loved Bay and Wilson and Sanchez and all of them, too, but they were a losing team, sad to say. Now, I think we have the beginning of a legitimate farm system with plenty of top draft picks. Sure, some of them may flop, but having any succeed is more than we've had before. My immediate concern is our double-play potential now. Even with all of our bad teams, we've always been near the top in double-plays. I like being good at double-plays. I hope the new guys we get to fill those roles will be as proficient as Jack and Freddy. They gave us countless hightlights through their years. So who are our new headliners now? Duke, McCutchen, Doumit? Better get used to seeing their faces a lot Brian_V
|
|
|
Post by BrianV on Jul 29, 2009 23:51:15 GMT -4
Reading some blogs from all 3 teams, the general concensus seems to be that while the Giants and Mariners are better teams immediately from the trades, their fans feel that they each gave up too much for what they got in return. With their contracts, Wilson and Sanchez weren't going to be with us much longer anyway, so to get the kind of prospects we did seems like we made out well.
Brian_V
|
|
|
Post by smalltown on Jul 30, 2009 2:08:26 GMT -4
Alderson, who's 6-foot-6 with good offspeed stuff, has been outstanding in his brief pro career, compiling a 20-6 record and 3.07 ERA in 47 games (46 starts). He has 202 strikeouts to just 51 walks in 249 innings.
Alderson was called up to Connecticut in early May and went 6-1 with a 3.47 ERA for the Defenders. His .265 opponents' batting average is a bit high, as are his 76 hits allowed in 72 2/3 innings, but the good ERA proves he knows how to work out of trouble.
|
|
|
Post by jimmyb on Jul 30, 2009 12:21:49 GMT -4
I was in 9th grade in high school the last time the Pirates were in the playoffs. If they'd use the Brooklyn Dodgers saying" wait till next year" we'd being sick in tired of hereing it. This morning I was listening to XM 175 home plate and the show had a beat writer for the Pirates but I can't remember who it was but he said he talked to Kevin Young who once played in Pittsburgh and lives in Arizona now, said we was part of the first rebuilding of the Pirates, he just didn't realized that they'd be still rebuilding 17 years later. This franchise is a joke!
So let's start with this. Ownership has to be the cheapest ownership in MLB. The Nutting family must sell to a ownership that is willing to spend some money on it's MLB roster instead of putting it into the minors. They received 27 million dollars part of revanue sharring in MLB. So were's the money?? Did it go into contracts on the Pirates roster?? Since the soft cap and revanue sharring started I wonder how much money the Pirates have received from MLB?? The Nuttings are frauds, cheats and liars. MLB should investigate what they do with all that money.
Neal Huntington, I give him a chance to improve this team but please no more saying "In a few years we will have a quality baseball team that fans can connect too" If you need to fill your minor leagues with prospects your scouts must not very good at there job. The future must be NOW!! No more laters, the fans are tired of listening to false propaganda. If this contiunes fans will no longer spend there money on Pirate tickets no matter the price, stop supporting the team because they'll get attached to a player, he'll get good and be a all-star then get traded because we need to get younger and it was a good deal for both teams. Like Areosmith song" Same old song and dance" Your here the same quote from the GM every single year. There are no guareenties that any of the top draft picks will ever be impact players down the line. I don't like when players handcuff ownership with demends on salary and say " I want to stay, it's not about the money" When you traded Jack Wilson you also traded a leader, captain and your best defensive player you have. Leadership is what keeps that clubhouse from fallilng about. Is Andrew McCutchen going to be traded in 5 years, I wonder??
If this trading good players doesn't stop soon no one will show up at PNC Park, games on FSN will be cut down to save money. Would you go to watch the Pirates nowing they have no chance of making the playoffs or even making to .500 why waist your time right?? This is why MLB must have a salary cap so that every team can be even on the money scale. I can accept losing but not for 17 years. It must end now!!
|
|
AmyV
Senior Member
Let's Go Bucs!
Posts: 199
|
Post by AmyV on Jul 30, 2009 12:43:10 GMT -4
Amen Jimmy B (on certain parts. I <personally> wouldn't say that the team itself is a joke....just the Front Office. Also, I am still going to watch them because I like baseball and they are my favorite team whether they lose or not but I will admit I would like to see a winning season soon. )
I do believe we are the cheapest organization in the Majors. No doubt about that!
What Neal needs to realize that he is obviously treating this as a business, but by trading away our good players who are very popular, they are losing fans (except for the really dedicated ones). Sure this is not a popularity contest but people enjoyed watching them play and now they are no longer with us. The only person who is still on the team (and playing everyday) since Home Opener is Andy LaRoche. Everyone else got traded!
Oh well I guess now we just have to sit back and watch what happens with the new guys. My dad and I are going to the game tomorrow (if it doesn't rain) so I will be able to check out Cedeno and the others to see how they are. I hope they make a good first impression.
|
|